Death fields speculation


  • Little rambly i just jump from thought to thought

    I really like the death fields sets so i figured we could speculate on it's future. The rules will release at some point I'm hoping they have some cool aspects and it might be worth considering making a "homebrew" version made for a more DND style adventure in the setting. whether it's fan-made or not is another story. I'm hoping we get a few alien races eventually though I understand the point is humans are the best at war. I wonder how many sets they will release before launching the rules. I'd really like some cowboys and Indians sets but that might be unlikely. calvary in the game at all could be very fun. I also hope for more lore to be provided at some point. I'm a little curious if other figures will have female sets like cannon fodder, but I didn't buy the female cannon fodder and I don't think I would prefer new designs over female versions of old ones. I also think since the rough design is very similar they might not have to put as much time into them which might allow for filler between new releases.



  • I would definitely love to see Space Samurai and maybe some Space Orcs? I know 40k Orks exist, but I mean in the sense of a spaceborne brute species. Maybe closer to Krogan? No idea. But there is a space for big bad aliens.


  • @Javier Del Villar i believe they had some ogres set up


  • @Javier Del Villar If they do Space Orcs I kind of hope we'd see something completely different as a take for them. Smart, sophisticated orcs, with advanced weaponry and a mastery of genetic modification perhaps, with the green skin something they did to themselves, to allow for photosynthesis maybe (and that would open the path for different skin colours as they alter their genes to adapt to different stars light wavelengths).

     

    I appreciate that there's a big market for 40K proxy models, and that that must be a big chunk of sales, but I also want to have more than just not-GW models.

     

    It's why I'm hoping we get some rules sooner rather than later, because I want this to at least have the option to be It's own thing. Ideally we'll get some skirmish scale stuff, games you only need a single box of figures to be able to play a game with. After that, I want some proper RPG and full army battle systems built off it, of course.


  • @Stilton Disco that is an interesting take on orcs. 


  • I'd like for them to beef up the already made groups like the lizard-men and spiders (especially these guys) it's something that's so rarely done and they made them seem rather original. Maybe a heavy weapon or mech style... it's just such an alien thought since they are so physically different from us.


  • @david phillips I just want something different to Tolkien or GW. 

     

    You could still have them being violent and war like, just change their cultural reason for aggression up.

     

    Perhaps they hold a Nietsche like philosophy of survival of the fittest, and that the end justifies the means, but on a species level. They see evolution as a zero sum game, and they intend to win.

     

    Testing their new genetic upgrades in the Death Fields would be an easy way to judge how their adaptations are performing without starting an actual war, as another idea.


  • I think that it's time for some kind of preliminary/"beta test" rules.

    Maybe even a competition among customers to create these preliminary rules.

    Maybe even allow customers to playtest a couple of different rules candidates.


  • @Stilton Disco hey actually sci-fy orcs are a great idea. i was actually thinking about your proposal for genetic modification. early orcs were based on Mongolian tribes the hoard so to speak. while the stereotype inspiring orcs is not perfect the real-world association makes me think these orcs should be twisted Mongols in style. 


  • Yeah, when I mentioned the space orcs, I wanted something more along brute style. I think smart orcs like the Spacejammer analogues would be great. Those were greatly loved due to how different they were while still being "orcish".

    As for rules, I'd love to take a tackle at something like this. It seems very cool to create a variant culture based on existing ones but in SPAAAAAAACE! It would largely depend on what WGA wants, but on the skirmish scale, the game would be great since it has the arena backdrop already. But a campaign mode would be great too to develop a team into something else.


  • @david phillips super high tech space orc Mongolians would actually be pretty awesome. 

     

    Riding jet bikes, conquering everywhere they can with rapid strike, merciless assaults, destroying entire worlds on principle if they don't immediately surrender, building great empires they rule with a fair but merciless iron fist. Could be rad.


  • I'd like to see the general orcish type filled by something slightly more alien, similar to the baddies from Galaxy Quest or The 5th Element.

     

    Rules would in my opinion be a misstep.  If they don't catch on, WGA will have wasted a lot of time and money.  If they do catch on, they will dominate the creative process and trap miniature development into a spiral of servicing the game followed by a new edition to service the poorly selling models.  I'd prefer for Death Fields to feel more creative and open in what can come next rather than become stale as they fill predictable game play archetypes.


  • @BS Kitbasher plenty of systems exist out there that don't have those problems. They don't need to make rules for every single faction and model kit they produce, just some general purpose stuff that you can buy any set for and use equally would be grand. 


  • @BS Kitbasher yeah that's only GW. Plenty of other games out there don't suffer from that type of cycle. Besides they already mentioned there will be a game.

    Back on the rules, I also think we need some lore that can also tease us about the future. I'm wondering about aliens too! Though Iron Core is getting some aliens at SOME point.


  • @BS Kitbasher the death fields range page says they are building towards a game release


  • I would like very much for WA to print a set of rules I could buy, or download. Would prefer a physical book mind you, paper back is fine.

    In the meantime I have been thinking up my own, and collecting what figures I like.


  • @George P

    For the Lizardmen, given they cover for fantasy and VSF as well, I could see them with a lot actually:

    An Upgrade sprue(s) with: different tails (Chameleon ones), more fantasy melee weapons (like more swords, hand axes, clubs, maybe a knife), maybe some kind of Sci-fi weapon like a machine gun or flamer, couple pistols (at least one flintlock), maybe sheilds,  maybe some scopes, maybe native built bolt action guns, and definitely something German for VSF gaming (like Dreyse needle-guns, Mauser Model 1871s or even Werder M1869s).

    A multi genre heavy weapon set with: flintlock cannons, maybe a generic Gatling gun or scraped together machine gun, maybe a ballista or catapult.

    A Multi genre cavalry set.

    Maybe some armored lizardmen for heavy troops that could be used for both fantasy, VSF and Sci-Fi.

    Maybe a flying mount set.

    Maybe some smaller reptile allies.

    For the Spiders I am not really sure what you could add since they are kind of a fill in for bugs in Sci-Fi which use swarm tactics normally except maybe some upgrade sprues with things like mines (spiders leave traps) and different fireteam type weapons. Maybe a bigger spider with a mounted Sci-Fi cannon.


  • @Jonovious I think we need some beta rules we can try first. Having these forums and community pages is a great way for them to have feedback, balance the game and toast any cheese that's discovered before putting anything into print.

     

    I'm a big fan of One Page Rules myself, so I'm hoping or something simple and quick.

     

    Ideally we'll get a PDF released here we can try our and give them battle reports and army lists to look over. The more we can do for them early on, the better the actual game will be.


  • @david phillips

    I feel like that person arguing about female sports via miniatures by posting this, but while I agree they don’t need to make female versions of all the old sets cause they already have head swaps,  if they are going to do females for Death Fields,  I do think the female cannon fodder is a step in the right direction particularly for unarmored minis but even armored minis in the future since:

    1. Female soldiers should look different all the way so a casual observer can tell at a glance on the tabletop since otherwise it an almost pointless variation since if one wants them not to look female but have "female representation"  just using enclosed helmets and saying "the boys and girls" when you introduce them  gets the job done just as well and saves sprue space that could be used for other things.
    2. Real world physical factors and yes those are real even for armor, read this article.
    3. We can have more uniform variety this way and female bodies which work for other things. While I am not a fan Heroic scale for VSF gaming, female Bulldogs would be great for some folk in that arena, particularly if they have skirts, and I can see several SF heroine uses for the female cannon fodder with the heads.

     

    Also not to sound sexist, but while you didn’t buy the female cannon fodder, setting wise I didn’t really believe a lot of the pervious female offerings for Death Fields.  Most of those cultures didn’t really develop female warrior traditions till very recently in the latter half of 20th century (1950’s onward at best, but it really is more of a late 70's to early 90's for most) and frankly I am wondering where they came from and considering what’s going on in setting why they would be allowed to participate  (and no; cantinière, nurses and crossdressers + a couple centuries are not real good answers for both questions). The female cannon fodder set make’s far more sense by comparison since that’s a lot of different cultures military traditions forced together under duress.  

     


  • @Brian Van De Walker I see your point, but it's worth noting the deathfields cultures have been sitting in a different state than when they were taken for centuries I could view their culture-shifting. probably never a 50/50 ratio but maybe an 80/20 could feasibly be made with the desire for more soldiers and most women would know how to shoot a gun in case of attacks. not to say your points are invalid just worth considering. also, just a tip I find people are more skeptical of what I say if I start the statement with "not to sound sexist"


  • I'd love to see some alien kits that aren't plucked from GW or Mantic's roll call.

    The totally-not-squats-or-forge-fathers are cool, but I think there is plenty of scope to go further out of the box. Something more tentacle-y, or insectoid, or dark and gribbly in a cthulhu-esque manner would be fun to see. 


  • @david phillips I say offer sperate sets and let people buy them if they want, don't if they don't. Unless they create actual fiction for Death Fields, female  combatants should really not be made a big fuss about, because someone is going to be upset either way.

     

    Personally I would buy them, because I like women warriors in my fiction, but I totally get where others come from in it breaking their suspension of disbelief.

     

    Saying that, if we're going into genetic engineering with the Ogres, I would absolutely like to see genetically altered warrior women, maybe Spartans mixed with the mythical Amazon's or something.


  • RE:  Space Orcs:

    We could roll with the Death Fields background fluff (and I think we should):

    For thousands of years, advanced alien civilizations have visited the Earth for one purpose: to steal their bravest warriors. For centuries, the cream of Earth's soldiers have been taken against their will to fight, die, and be reborn in arenas throughout the galaxy.

    The Game Guilds provide some of the most watched sport in the known universe with matches broadcast in thousands of systems. A perennial favorite of sports fans everywhere are the humans - a primitive race from the far edge of the galaxy.

    Over the millennia, the finest warriors of that backwater planet have been brought to the arenas to fight each other and a host of other sentient species and deadly creatures. Even now, thousands of years since abductions began, Recruiters still acquire the best of Human space's warriors for the games.

    The humans go on in their tiny light-years bubble of space attacking each others colony worlds, believing themselves the most advanced race in the universe while the rest of the galaxy watches their immortal ancestors fight and die in the Death Fields...

     

    So, if we think of "Space Orcs" as being drawn from human history (or at least a sci-fi take on human history), maybe they actually take the form of something like:

    • Sci-Fi Neanderthals:  Cave Men with Particle Cannons!
    • Sci-Fi Morlocks:  Driven into underground vaults and tunnels in some far-future dystopia, to subsist on cannibalism and horror in the subterranean darkness, without sunlight, these Morlocks have degenerated far from ordinary human barbarism, but not so far that they haven't forgotten how to build and use sophisticated technologies of war, and not so far into barbarism that they won't work together as a team in the Death Fields!
    • Post-Apocalyptic Mutants:  After one of the many apocalyptic wars in Earth's troubled future empire, mutants like these - twisted by radiation, genetically-engineered diseases, and ghastly chemical warfare - arose from the ashes to rebuild civilization, and resume their favorite past-time:  war!  Compared to the bombed-out hell-holes they called home, the Death Fields are a vacation....

     

    I think I rather like the Sci-Fi Morlocks version:  I would hope such a thing would be modeled on the guys from that great classic '50s version of "The Time Machine", only with weapons and armor:

    Give them some shirts or armor or something so their arms can be used with other kits (and vice-versa), but really, these guys are a branch of humanity in the original story, while as stooped, humanoid, troglodytic, cannibal monsters, they are "orcs" in all but name.

    I'm also inclined to like the pot-apocalyptic mutants - give them strange, lumpen appearances, blisters, twisted features, and arm, leg, and head options for horrific defects, radiation burns, and so on, and dress them up like something out of a post-apocalyptic sci-fi thing, and you're got something a little different from the usual GW Orcs, while fitting into the same general "Orc" template.  See "Beneath the Planet of the Apes" or "The Omega Man" for just a couple of the more human ways this faction might be modeled:

     

    Whatever the case, I think I'd go with savage human army from pulp prehistory, or some sort of apocalyptic future, for some pre-human or post-human monsters of some sort.  If the model components also happen to be compatible with Wargames Atlantic's Classic Fantasy goblins, then so much the better!

     

     


  • We have the Einherjar, so how about the Svartaelfar as well? Norse Dark Elfs gone techie.


  • @Yronimos Whateley not a horrible set of ideas I think I would still rather have them be Mongolians mutated after being captured


  • @Chris Pryme The other miniature company already services the market for high-tech death metal elves pretty well; did you have anything in mind that would help to differentiate the two? 


  • I've always seen dark elves, orcs, Unseelie Court, Lovecraft's ghouls, D&D's drow and derros, and their mutual prototype in Richard Sharpe Shaver's deros, and the like as more or less the same basic creature, given different names for different contexts:  bestial, frail, immortal, undead, functionally albino humanoids driven out of the sunlight, deep underground, to live in subterranean civilization of darkness where they delight in madness, evil, witchcraft, sadism, and cannibalism, especially when inflicted on surface-dwellers in the form of dangerous pranks like kidnapping children to raise up as monsters, and leaving their own changelings in the child's place, to grow up with horrible appetites and a mischievous cruelty in spite of the parents' best efforts to raise the child properly...  Tolkien wasn't the first or the last to toy with the idea that orcs/goblins were simply fallen, evil, unseelie elves!  And I get the impression from the old folklore on dark elves, goblins, orcs, and the like that the concept might go back to ancient folklore that understood old pagan tombs to be the entrances to an underground afterlife where the Old Ones live in a sort of eldritch fairyland afterlife parallel to this world, from which the dead "elves" might rise up to the mortal world in the form of vampires, ghouls, ghosts, and phantoms of all kinds.

    Perhaps a "space orc" concept similarly borrows from and spills over into "death metal elves IN SPACE" territory, as well as space morlock territory, and vice-versa. 

    Someone posted a great kit-bash project they're working on, combining German helmets with gas masks and WWI French trenchcoat torsoes, with Raumjager flamethrowers, to produce some great pulp sci-fi bad-guys - seriously, check that project out

    I thought to myself, that looks like a cool project, and now I kinda want to steal the idea to make a squad of post-apocalyptic cyborg ghouls like the guy from those early '80s heavy metal album covers, apparently inspired by some old French Heavy Metal magazine illustrations:

     

    Gas masks... trench coats... pickelhaubes... shoulder armor... bullet belts... weird assault rifles... skulls... mutations, mutilations, war, and pain... and spikes, lots and lots of spikes!

    Given, perhaps, some sort of "Transylvanian" flavor, maybe that's the unique spin on those death-metal space elves/orcs we seem to be looking near? 

    These dark impalers were, perhaps, recruited for the Death Fields from some shadowy, far-future post-apocalyptic colony death-world at the borders of the Empires of Man, where these warriors have manned crumbling castles in high mountains and dark prieval forests, outposts in desolate wastelands and cobwebbed and damp underground bomb-shelters, where they have, through endless, apocalyptic, total warfare, been containing a mind-shattering alien threat lurking even deeper under the ground in vaults and caverns of unspeakable cosmic horror:  the impalers are the only thing keeping these ancient enemies from spilling out of those lower vaults of horror onto the surface of their world, and spreading from there into the galaxy at large, where they will surely run amok until they topple the unprepared, decadent and corrupt central empires of man..... The Death Fields are like a war school for the impalers, where they will learn new ways to fight and vanquish the darkness beneath their world!


  • If we're to get space orcs.. I want something unrelated to GW, mantic, and Tolkien's versions. Give me a Scifi take on D&D pigfaced orcs (higher tech gamorreans?), Or uplifted chimpanzees, or whatever. Something that fits the "orcs in Space" trope of humanoid, cheap, numerous, and scavenged gear. Without being just a copy of some other companies style.


  • Would be interesting to see some historical Arab or Indian cultures with sci-fi weaponry.

    Other than that maybe Vietminh geurillas with hi-tech weapons who focus on ambushes

     

     

     

     


  • Truthfully, I think wargames Atlantic are going to pull something similar to Mongoose Publishing back when they launched Starship Troopers. I could see them getting a big name like Toumas Pirinin or Alessio Carvatore in to do the rules. They said in their recent post they are getting the right people in, and there's literally no one better at games than them. I expect the game to probably be easily scalable with a separate skirmish bit and I'm hoping it's what 40k should be. Easy, fun, without bloat or power creep.

    Secondly, as far as the ranges, there's far too many potential ideas out there to make everyone happy. Personally I'd love to see a stealth camo cloak unit that's good at sniping, but I doubt that will happen. With umpteen potential ideas, and then each of those umpteen ideas needing a few boxes to cover all bases, I wonder if now is the time to be focusing on aliens and such? Would it not make more sense to get the space brits/space USA out the door and then backfill the ranges with heavy weapons before moving on? 

    As far as what we could see included alien wise, I think the lizard men and the spiders are a sure bet. I'm also wondering what other fantasy kits could make the cross over into sci-fi. Personally I'd love to see werewolves for classic fantasy and then for them to have guns and brought across into death fields. They'd be an instabuy for most space wolf players, no one does decent werewolves and they could go any way they wanted with them. I suspect zombies are another kit that could translate over from fantasy to death fields easily. 

     


  • You know, Space Wolves remind me of something that hadn't occurred to me before: 

    Militaristic Alien Space Cats

    I've known more than a few monkey boys who would scream and leap at a chance to do some sci-fi wargaming with some of those, but I don't think there have ever been any such thing made in plastic.

    Not sure if that's a licensing thing or not; surely there's some breathing room for someone to make some generic cat-aliens in space armor, before the lawyers start rolling in, and then again, the Known Space thing seems like it was fairly open-source up to a point, so who knows?

    I, for one, would be interested, though.


  • What about an army tht terrified half of Europe at the time? One of the first professional armies that brought low ancient empire. With options for both ranged and melee troops in exotic dress and armor, known for their ruthlessness, zeal and bravery and incredible "noise" their musicians made in battle...

    I`m talking about Ottoman Janissaries.

    Pin on Ottoman Empire

    They can be made both similar enough to other sets and unique enough to make them interesting:

    "Laser" muskets, Yatagan knives, round kalkan shields, futuristic "bows" for marksmen

    Webstore: Ottoman Janissaries - Warlord Games

    yannisary headdresses or eastern style helmets, with gasmasks or with face masks instead or maybe relective visor to make them scarier?

    Janissary | CGTrader

    Zozok is the creature that can help Safaan cleaning their pores. Zozok can  eat that sweat. When the sw… | Janissaries, Fantasy character design,  Cyberpunk character


  • I think it'd be interesting to do Space Afghasty for Space Soviets, as a departure from the typical view of Soviet pastiches of Ushankas and Greatcoats.


  • I think a middle eastern based range would be excellent (plus as a bonus would work as a Tallarn based army in 40k) ..... space camels ? 😂


  • @Robert Barber maybe it would be cool if they're cosmonauts rather than military troops.

    As a bit of fluff it could be the case that since they were the first to make it to space it put them on the radar of the shadowy aliens who run the Death Fields

    I feel like having some Mexican bandits/Zapatistas (lumping them together because the stereotypical bandit is pretty much that famous photo of Emiliano Zapata) could be cool, so long as they're not racist caricatures


  • If we are talking Alien style races, I'd love to see a Kilrathi style cat person army, as well as something that comes with Wings. 


  • @Stephen Sutton Less spikes :)

     

    I was thinking of their depiction in the Iron Druid series. Particularly after the Aelfar and Dwarves started throwing in together.

     


  • Man, I'd buy the hell out of some sci-fi cowboys and Indians.  Wild West Exodus is just too busy-looking for me, if someone put out some that were a tad toned-down visually, I'd snatch them up in a heartbeat!


  • Space Robots, Generic Space Mercenaries, High Elves, Bugs, Cyborgs, there are honestly so many neat possibilities here I would'nt know where to begin. As as for the rules they fit plenty of smaller game rulesets already and are perfect for homebrew as you said 😀 I'm actually currently building a quick skirmish ruleset that these would be perfect for 🤙


  • Kitties in Space would be my first vote, followed by gun toting Insectoids, and finally apes, a la planet of.


  • Anyone know if an Einherjar command/support kit is on its way?


  • Ive been thinking of adding Americans to the setting. I think I'd go Scifi Old West. Think Firefly, Westworld, Beebop, Fallout New Vegas, Dark tower, and maybe even a smidge of Brave Star. Not sure if they'd fit since it really isn't an army, but it's iconic and there are a lot of sources to draw from. 

     

    Also if we're adding aliens, why not keep with the time travel motif and add dino-sapiens, or Neo-anderthals.

     


  • @Red Bee 

    Man I loved that show.


  • New speculation: the next Einherjat set will include a mug of beer on the sprue, and the next Raumjagger set will have a frankfurter. Please.


  • @JTam  

    Indeed, a lot of people are basing their current Stargrave crew on Firefly/Serenity. 


  • @Steven StGeorges 

    That would be really cool.

    The Firefly crew may have infiltrated another game as well:

    (She looks like she would fit right in with the Eldar Corairs in the new Kill Team box set.)


  • @JTam  

    Thanks a lot, totally forgot about the Hardcore Minis' models. Now I have to convince wife I do really need them. 

    But I think I saw another mini of Malcom Reynolds somewhere while looking for something else. Have to check my favourites. 


  • Yet more SciFi Old West:


  • Right now, Space Westerns are pretty well catered for, and you have an easy mashup with parts from the Dead Man's Hand kits.

    Robots or would be top of my list, though Space Kitties or Space Dogs would not be bad.

    Sticking with the *actual* premise of Death Fields (humans pulled from history), what about Plains Indians?


  • @JTam  Those Anvil Industries space cowboys & cowgirls look pretty good and Anvil Industries has a pretty good rep.


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