iron-core and tank2

  • @vissly cao  Are those Dragonball models I see them riding in up there?

  • @Brian Van De Walker yes!!

  • @vissly cao Guess I should track some down. They look great.👍

  • Great paintjob... I like it all... but - as a german - i don't like that Hakenkreuz... bad idea for me...

    As a "german konservative" - that means Republican in the USA - i don't like that symbol, to much bad feelings about that... to much of everything bad. But that's a personal thought...

    Please more pictures - that gives me more ideas to bulid my own iron core army up... 

  • @Frank Reischmann Sorry, I didn't notice that. But I like their uniforms. In the future, I will pay attention to those taboos in the photos.

  • @vissly cao Don't worry, if these are meant to be the "bad guys", so the swastikas help to identify them as such, f.e. being allied to some "evil empire", justfying their massacre by the "good guys"😃

    P.s. excellent work, expecially with the faces.

  • The older I get the more sensitive I seem to be about certain symbols, so yeah I winced a bit when I spotted that. Just as I cringe a bit inside every time I see a Confederate flag on display. Perhaps it comes in part from living in Germany now and seeing how Nazi symbols are treated here compared to how innocuously Confederate flags have been portrayed through much of my life (instead of treated as the symbols of hate that they really are). Perhaps it is the resurgence of Neo-Nazis and Neo-Confederates in the States and elsewhere. But yeah, both symbols make me uncomfortable.

    But at the same time I have been a historical re-enactor and “played as one of the bad guys”. I have worn a politically insensitive costume for a Halloween contest. I have had plenty of WW2 models with such symbols on them.

    But never to glamorize what they represent.

    It is interesting to see how the museums in Normandy manage to walk the fine balance of respectful historical accuracy and yet not glamorizing Nazism. Something some American museums could learn in regards to the American Civil War. 

    For me context is king. Symbols have power and it is important to respect that and make sure that people understand what you want to portray. 

    And in wargaming I suppose the only thing better than a Nazi villain to beat is a Zombie Nazi villian. 

    Edit: So, all that said, I am looking forward to seeing how your project continues and your repurposing of those pieces to make vehicles is clever. As for their appearance, politics aside, the Wehrmacht and Waffen SS certainly had a sense for fashion. 

  • @vissly cao 

    Hey, no problem... ;-) ... as german you must be sensitive about that... rest of the world have no problem... as seen in ukraine... ;-)

    Please go on with this project... a want to see many more of youtr troops... 

  • @vissly cao 

    Amazing job!  Keep doing what your doing and keep posting pics!

  • The Swastika could have been transformed, that's for sure... A simple Iron Cross, with the palm tree, could have suggested the thing without hurting.

    That said, the work done is prodigious, inspired and very well done. Bravo, Vissly Cao.

    The Germans - all the Germans - paid for the despicable crimes of 10 or 20% of them. Those of today are so different : they have learned the cruel lesson of the History. I have a lot of esteem and sympathy for them (für euch, hier, meine deutschen Brüder).

  • Or get rid of that part of the symbol and use them as a faction to refight the Great Cola Wars...

  • Thing is, there is a big difference between the symbols cropping up on historical models, and deliberately using them on science fiction ones. The former can be tolerated, the latter is best avoided.

    The DAK obviously did use this seal, but looking at the photos of their vehicles the straight armed Balkenkreuz is the most prominent marking anyway. However, German flags were often draped over them as makeshift aircraft identifiers, especially on captured vehicles and trucks, which is a more prominent swastika display. Everyone was using sand coloured camo, so that's no real surprise.

    What's the context on the models anyway?

  • Very funny, it looks like Rammstein !!! I didn't knew Afri'kola : modern Pervitin ?

    What is good for us, Basques, is that our solar cross (lauburu) is still usable...

    That's a fact : in Asia, the Swastika remains a benefic symbol. In China and Corea, the mark of the Devil is rather the radiant sun of the Japanese empire, not ?

  • @Pierre Lerdou-Udoy 



  • I note that the palm without swastika, or "Afrika" swapped in is often seen as a gaming alternative. That's what Battlefront have chosen to do for Flames of War products:

    German Dak Panzer Company (GEAB22)

    German Afrika Korps Gaming Set (TD051)

    They universally use the old Imperial German flag instead of the version with the iron cross swapped out for the swastika, or the Nazi flag. It all simplifies sales in Germany, and I guess they'd rather defend that decision against a few grumpy historians who can paint their toys how they like ANYWAY, than against people genuinely triggered by Nazi symbology.

  • Not upsetting people is probably now the most hardest thing to do in our lives,  I hope you all know me well enough to know that l like and respect most folk,  lifes too short to fight or hurt people. A strange thing to say considering our hobby. That all it is a however a hobby. When I was a child l played cowboys and indians,  ran around with my scooter as a horse. and shot cap guns. When I was a teen l played Wargames, shot Germans, French, Italian, British the whole lot.  I read books as varied as can be Si/Fi., factual, I never wanted to  offend any one in the games I played or the SS books I read.  I was disgusted by stories and events I read. But the badge or symbol on a plane/ tank  etc  did not become apparant to me until "Airfix" began changing the markings. Perhaps at my age my brain can't  see the harm, I don`t  know. When  I build a model for a game or display I`ve a story  in my mind behind it and I want it as accurate as I can, the research l do to try and make that machine even a wargame or Si/Fi piece correct is at times mind numbing. I`ve an SS Tiger thats 100 % I`d hate to offend with.  I`ve also one 100% correct with a "White Rose" on aerial recognition (Reason in my Wierd War 2 "White Rose" signifies that the unit is now fighting along side the alies against the Zombie etc. Not all SS were evil. The same will apply to Wierd War Nam as I build that.

    I`ve been a lot luckier than it seems as  many of you out there lived a life with all colour of friends and sexual orentation and that's it, they have been friends,  I hope any images of mine shone in the future do not offend, it will never be this old farts wish, to do that merely just make the best model this old brain will give me. Cheers all Geoff.

  • @Pierre Lerdou-Udoy Yes, we don't like what Japan did during WW II. But now we have no prejudice against New Japan

  • Thank you for the feed-back, Vissly Cao.

    It's exactly the same in Europe. But as I have family members and friends in Germany, Austria and Süd-Tirol, I understand that the subject of "the old symbols" is very delicate there.

    For me, no problem, your work is very bright, just great.

  • @Grumpy Gnome Am I correct in thinking it was "Martha Washington" graphic novels that featured the cola and burger wars.

  • @Geoff Maybury I am unaware of those graphic novels, but I have seen “The Great Cola Wars” references in a number of satirical applications.

  • @Grumpy Gnome She`s shown on the cover in a dress uniform reminisant of a female U.S Cavalery person with a sword on her side,  and yellow stripe down her leg. It is however set in the future, and I have vague memories of a cola war story.

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