Here's a spot to discuss this listing in Vox Populi!
Cannon Fodder Command and Heavy Support
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Hudson Adams Moderator
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I know there isn't much to talk about with no image, but I'd suggest something akin to an arm control panel. Something that could be used to detonate soldiers with explosives.
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No pics?
No progress??
This is very frustrating because I have big plans for an army of these guys (alternative Imperial Guard of course ☺). I'm pimping them up with additional shoulder pads, weapons, and equipment from various sources and it's great fun 😊
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Don't worry everyone, I have a stand in pics🤣:
Yeah, joking aside I am pretty sure its just going to be the Damned clean heavy weapons again with CF crew given the other Heavy weapon item thread (though a box of just the crew might be cooler for CF):
That said we can talk about what sort of extras we want in the command part of this set. I am thinking cowboy hats and built from junk hand guns and SMGs, how about you:
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@Brian Van De Walker Some (or most) of these weapons seems more dangerous for the users than for enemies....
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just put some money into this, looks like theres an issue with the vote counter (says 680, but 138x5 + 2x50 is 790). Edit: looks like there's a delay for the main page
looking forward for some support for my bond-villain henchpeople/generic space people.
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@Brian Van De Walker I think we all need a heavy caliber, small arms weapon with a bicycle handle welded to it. Make it happen Wargames Atlantic!
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@Hudson Adams
Any chance we can get a preview of what sort of heavy weapons and/or command y'all are thinking about for our the cannon fodder set? Are these parts going to be pulled from the cannon fodder civilians set, or all new stuff?
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@Alessio De Carolis That's the point.😄
We are talking a "broadcasted gladiatorial arena in the stars" setting, I think entertainment value and showmanship should trump safety concerns and practicality (this is also another argument for skirts on female minis).
Besides a lot of the weapons in 40k was just as bad (don't get me started on that toyatic dumpster fire of a tech tree😆).
@Andrew Fernandez Yes we all need that!😆
Though I am pretty sure that is a pic of a one shot "harness gun" where the "harness" is made with lead pipes. Not a good life choice weapon.😉
@Isaac Lee I think you should consider the space dwarf and damned heavy weapon set previews as a clue to what the weapons will look like.
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Though I suppose realisticaly this and suicide bomber vests could be the heavy weapon option for the CF, though that might be a touch to controversial😆:
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Guys I just had a thought, after reading @Alessio De Carolis argument in the dwarves thread (which used poor examples for "under done subjects" compared to Dwarves by the way) and given the Death Field's Lore we have realistically wouldn't the CF's Command and Heavy Support basically just be the "Death Fields Corporate Arena Security" with a set of the big guns? maybe a similar deal with heavy troopers? Afterall I don't really see the CF themselves getting trusted with heavy assets normally (functional ones anyways) and most of 40k penal leigons had Wardens leading them anyways if recall correctly.
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I think what would help is keeping in mind the 'themes' of the original sets - human bombs, and generic sci-fi infantry in at least two flavours, plus the cheap-and-not-very-cheerful cybernetics introduced in the first (and so far only) accessory sprue and the female box set. The command sprue could aid in creating veterans with further bionics, perhaps even chunky bionic legs underneath those jump suits, and have options for more 'prisoner officer'-looking leaders who are itching to remote detonate the bomb-rigged conscripts.
My disappointment in the 3D print Security Team is that none of them have truncheons to, ah, encourage the rank and file.
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@Brian Van De Walker
2 of the CF heads/themes (sci-fi explorers and James Bond henchmen) would definitely use heavy weapons, and I'm pretty sure penal legions can use the same heavy weapons other imperial militias can use in that game from Nottingham (at least they can in 30k, don't know about the new NMNR policy for 40K). I don't know if the 80's African warlord weapons theme really fit any of those settings except for GW stuff.
Could we see some goofy mad science weapons that would show up in Star Trek, the expanse, or James Bond?
This one has been sitting at number 2 for a while with no information from Wargames Atlantic. I'm sure it would get a lot more interest if they could put up a drawing or two of what they have in mind.
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@Isaac Lee While its true 2 of the CF heads/themes are sci-fi explorers and James Bond henchmen, neither of those subjects have a tradtional need for heavy weapons persay outside vehicle mounted ones (there are so many films of each where heavy crew weapons would have changed the plot, First Alien movie would have been a 15 min one off action film and don't get me started on Bond films😆).
That said if its anything beside sucide bombers and scrap weapons (which would be perfect box lore wise for CF, I mean I just don't see sponsers handing them heavy weapons), best bet is its going be the Dwarf and Damned Heavy weapons all over again with new crew arms.
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What could be of use is extra stuff to put around the belt/waist of Cannon Fodder to further theme them.
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I think the Scrapheap Challenge stuff would look out of place with the original models. Their equipment was cheap, but not hastily improvised from things they found in the rubbish. They should probably have a utilitarian aesthetic, maybe even be quite robust. If the Cannon Fodder are expected to have a high churn rate due to dying the equipment should probably be built to last so that it can change hands many times before needing to be replaced.
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@Brian Van De Walker First Alien movie would have been a 15 min one off action film
I, er, don't know why a bunch of space truckers would have heavy weapons, and in Aliens they did have heavy weapons in the form of at least two 'smartguns'.
Please, Hudson, anyone, we're down to correcting each other about sci-fi films! A smidgen of preview! A crumb of an idea of what you're aiming for!
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@Stephen Sutton Given that the damned and space dwarfs are getting the same support weapons, possibly with the same clean gun sheilds (which I personally feel is a mistake), it is a fair bet they will be the same support weapons here fellas unless some more perculation is done though I suppose they could add the cool gun pod from the grogs or that RPG the Damned could have.
This is part of why I kept throwing scrap gun ideas out cause the design of heavy weapons looks like it is pretty much already chosen for these guys barring some real creative juice making and scrap guns make for intresting converstion topics. The other reasons are because these guys are best suited as proxy penal legion at the moment (which would use scarper heavy weapons and be the main reason to even have support weapons) and on a personal level in the off chance any of those ideas make it I could scavange them for my Damned army.
That said I suppose they could go with light infantry options (that rpg mentioned earler, mass produced hand morters, energy weapon equvlinet to one of those, etc.)
@Jim Heath your right they did have smartguns which are basicly HMGs in the second film! which was on a marine base! and in the hand of marines! which are more like I don't know the ooh-rah😆. They where used against hoards of xenos in the second film, against the one Xeno on a ship it would work fine (might puncture the ship's hull though). If they had any of those in the first film we both know it would have been short film, for a verity of reasons😆(of course the space truckers don't have heavy weapons, it would ruin the plotline)
I will admit have not seen any of the Alien films myself yet (I probably should watch the first one at least since Dad did recommend it), but I did read the wiki, on the gun.
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i'd prefer the light infantry take on cannon fodder myself, they're the dregs of the game circuit, so why spend much on fancy gear for them? at the same time, they're bankrolled groups with slick gear for their basic troops. so homebrew scrap weaponry doesn't fit them at all.
so i'd go with fairly basic light infantry gear.. shoulder fired rocket launchers (and some arms and packs for a loader), some grenade launchers, maybe a man portable light mortar. Sniper rifles. the kind of things that could be schlepped around easily.
for the command side, one thing i'd love to see would be Carbine and PDW/SMG versions of the laser rifles the regular troops carry. for the carbines, just shorter versions would work fine. for the SMG style you'd probably have to design a new version, perhaps a bullpup. maybe a few rifles with underslung grenade launchers.
maybe go for a more stargate-ish feel, which is a vibe i get from the images of the cannonfodder painted as wearing OD green jumpsuits. maybe toss some tactical vests over the jumpsuit for the command figures, and stick in some bulkier backpacks, tablet computers, and so on in as accessories.
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@Mithril2098 Yeah I think tactical vests for Cannon Fodder will be great. Man the Stargate Idea is really tempting me.
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it also has the benefit of matching well with the "bond villain minion" and "space explorer" sub-themes of the cannon fodder kit.
and it would be easier. a sniper rifle could easily be a slightly bulkier version of the standard rifle, with a blocky scifi optic on top. (like the "cobra assualt cannon" from the original robocop film, which was a barret M82 rifle with blocky computer thing on top.)
the rocket launcher could easily be modelled after an RPG-7 if you want a lighter look, or something like the Carl Gustav Recoilless Rifle. though if you really want to lean into the scifi look, the M202 FLASH would be a good choice. (IRL it was a napalm rocket and not HE, but the rockets fired were variants of those from the M72 LAW so the possiblity was there had it caught on)
(though that pic from Commando is just a prop with no rockets)as far as grenade launchers go, the iconic milkor style rotary drum, or the vietnam M79 'bloopgun' would both fit, though i have to admit a soft spot for the ultra rare (and sort of ridiculous) China Lake Grenade launcher. which was basically an oversized pump action shot gun for 40mm grenades. (there was a failed attempt to modernize it as well.)
not sure on mortars. they'd fit the style but might be harder to fit into the set. but someting like the light mortar used in the British expeditionary force set, a smaller bore mortar aimed by hand rather than using a bipod could fit easily. something like the cold war austrian M6C-210 or the south african M4 Commando mortar.
though the new LMP-2017 the Polish are using has a neat scifi look to them.
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@Mithril2098 I would be happy if they just skipped the grenade launchers (have tons and they are one of the most common parts sold in ebay bitlots and 3rd party part dealers) but if they are going to do them Bloop gun, pump action, or under attachment have my vote over rotary any day (that design have been done to death).
Though a hand cannon like gun such as the fictional Zorn Kampf Pistole from Metal Gear V or its real world inspiration might be fun alternative grenade launcher:
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Polish riot police used mosin and AK based grenade launchers, RWGŁ 1 and 3, small and rather unusual, perhaps usable in one hand in mini form
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those might be a bit small and easy forp players to misunderstand? they'd end up looking more like silenced pistols.
how about this contraption?
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/RGSh-30
fires 30x29mm grenades (same as the russian AGS-17 and AGS-30 automatic grenade launchers), and has a 5 round magazine
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@Mithril2098 I assume the grenade would be made very grenade-y for these to work! Shouldn't be a great leap to make fragmentation pieces visible. Or like something from last Brian's picture. Also speaking about these mostly as a source of inspiration, not 1:1 replica for the mini ;)
Yours could work as well, but I'd make the calibre much bigger and switch the magazine to something with munition visible or at least more hefty. Here it looks like a sawed anti-material rifle xD
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@Mithril2098 Well, that RGSh30 is way better than another rotary and it does look like something a SciFi ship crew might have.
@Drangir Maybe make the grenade in the hand cannon either a bigger version of the grenade from my last pic or more pinapple like varient of the first from that post.
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@Drangir @Brian Van De Walker could always replace the box magazine with a short section of linked belt feed so you can see the grenades.
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@Mithril2098 honestly I thought the box mag was grenade launcher like enough, just make the barrel big it would be fine. I just think a hand cannon would be would be cooler.
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I saw a really creative paint job on Facebook for this set. Maybe we need some bigger laser guns and swords to go kill Duncan Idaho.
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Well, we didn't quite make it for this round of approvals. I can't say I can hold it against the Waring States folks, as I've heard that bounced around since before the Grognards kit came out.
Any previews of any ideas the sculptors have had for the set? Prison Wardens, something to make the whole thing look more like a sci-fi psuedo military get-up, etc.
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i wonder if the sneak peek in the latest email update is part of the cannon fodder heavy weapons? though aesthetically it could be something for the ooh Rah too i guess.
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@Mithril2098 Honestly it looks more Ooh-Rah. Could be the spacenam stuff too.
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